What Will Joe Biden Say?
In advance of tonight’s vice presidential debate when the focus may be more on Sarah Palin than Joe Biden, the McCain campaign put out a web video today on some of Biden’s missteps.
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a major concession, Republican John McCain has abandoned efforts to win Michigan, a Democratic-leaning battleground state the GOP presidential candidate had hoped to capture. Republican officials with knowledge of the strategy said the GOP nominee is removing staff, curtailing advertising and canceling visits to the Midwestern state, which offers 17 electoral votes.
Resources will be sent to Ohio, Wisconsin, Florida and other competitive states.
reported from the associated press
whats the point of attacking the vice presidential candidate
do the McCain people think that JOes foot in mouth disease
will make up for the total lack of knowlege now being
attributed to palin by a majority of independent voters
who the hell is advising him
Keeping with his character, Joe Biden will say to Gov. Palin, “I knew Geraldine Ferraro—and you’re NO Geraldine Ferraro!” (viz: 1988; both Lloyd Bentsen’s retort to Dan Quayle, and Biden’s own plagiarism of Brit Neil Kinnock’s speech to Parliament.)
Gov. Palin SHOULD parody Tina Fey and ask for a “lifeline” after any aggressive, querulous examination from Delaware Joe. It will have the audience in gut-laughs. And win her votes from the genuine, regular citizens who thankfully populate our country.
But, really: the debates haven’t been anything like 1976, 1980, or 1984. And they promise to not be anything similar to those significant public displays, owing to the political managers extant.
I miss Roger Ailes’ availability as consultant to my Republicans this year. While he did bring us Dan Quayle (the wrong Senator from Indiana; Lugar would have had us in The White House for years), he also won us Nixon, for whom even Mike Wallace voted. Read Joe McGinniss’ “The Selling of the President 1968.” And Mike Wallace’s memoir.
Another journalist who voted for Nixon in 1968: Bob Woodward. Recently retired from the US Navy, as consultant to then-Col. Alexander Haig. Before Woodward went to work as suburban slave for WaPo.
Consultant…yesterday you agreed McCain was being too wishy-washy. Now you complain in the other direction.
What makes Biden a sacred cow? He was against the first Gulf War, even after Saddam had invaded Kuwait. More recently, he wanted to divide Iraq into three countries, and he also was against the Surge. Someone could do three hours of TV on Biden’s blunders and exaggerations.
If I was Palin, I’d make a point of quoting Biden saying how unqualified Obama is. And he said that many times.
Tim Hays…if Biden said “You’re no Geraldine Ferraro,”
Palin should answer, “Thank God for that. You wanna hear about her husband John Zaccaro, his ‘connections’ and that building in lower Manhattan? Wanna hear about Star Distributors?”
Actually, instead of Joe’s gaffes, Palin should focus on Biden’s credibility and Biden’s image as both a regular guy and a foreign policy expert? How many people know that Biden lives in a mansion or that he sold his last house for 1.2 million dollars to a MBNA executive? How many know that he favored a partition of Iraq and was adamently opposed to the surge (even though he voted in favor of the Iraq War)?
The question below from an article in the NY Times gets at the heart of his credibility problem.
“Senator Biden, you told me once that, shortly before the 2004 election, you advised John Kerry to respond harshly to a new Osama bin Laden videotape. You described the conversation this way: “I’m on the phone, I e-mail, I say, ‘John, please, say three things’: ‘How dare bin Laden speak of our president this way.’ No. 2, ‘I know how to deal with preventing another 9/11.’ No. 3, ‘Kill him.’†You then threw up your hands in disgust and said of Senator Kerry, “He didn’t make any of it. Let’s get it straight. None of it.â€
This story was entertaining, but it wasn’t strictly accurate. It turned out that you did not, in fact, even speak with Senator Kerry until well after he had issued a vigorous denunciation of bin Laden. This episode is one of several in which you have appeared to exaggerate your importance. Recently, you spoke of being “shot at†in Iraq. This, too, turned out to be false. Why should voters trust you, after you have made so many provably embroidered assertions?”
— JEFFREY GOLDBERG, a national correspondent for The Atlantic and the author of “Prisoners: A Story of Friendship and Terrorâ€
Jiminy,
Colin Powell, Don Rumsfeld, George H.W. Bush, and many others were against the first Gulf War only until Saudi Arabia, Jordan, and Israel put pressure on us to fight it. Biden’s position on that war is not a viable attack from Republicans because it was a majority position.
Two important things happened tonight: Sarah Palin held her own in the debate with Delaware Joe, and—most importantly—my Dodgers won in Wrigley, thus frustrating those poor Cub fans.
It’s important to remember that the last time my Dodgers won the World Series, in 1988, a Republican was elected president.
Oh well. It’s not like the Super Bowl indicator with the stock market (the Giants winning should have the market up by December 31) but it’s something.
Go Dodgers!
Sarah Palin was the slam-dunk winner of last night’s vp debate.
Millions of American men (legal registered voters, not off-the-boat illegals) would prefer to have sex with Gov. Palin rather than with Sen. Biden. The camera was better to Ms. Palin than it was to Delaware Joe. Her curvaciousness thwarted Biden’s white eyebrows.
Palin performed extremely well last night which should
go a long way toward getting McCain back a couple
of states he was tied in…it should also take the
focus off her qualifications and put the race back
in the context of voting for the next president rather
than against McCain because of his VP choice..the new
york times doesn;t think she did well..but guess what
its the folks out “yonder” who will judge her performance
Tim Hays displays a sense of humor there. I’d guarantee they’d prefer to “canoodle” with Palin rather than Biden.
Tim’s support of the Dodgers is another matter entirely. But look at it this way, maybe that curse of the Billy Goat will affect Chicago’s Obama, too.
I agree with Tim and the Consultant. Palin did very well last night…I mean in the debate. :) I’m also glad she used that “Say It Ain’t So, Joe!” line on Biden. I’ve been calling him that for about two months.
We wouldn’t expect the NY Times and others of that ilk to give points to Palin. They can’t admit their bias and errors. But she does relate to and connect with the “real America” very well. The Times and most of the NY, L.A. and D.C. media are clueless about the “real America.”
The game is on again.
Jiminy,
Do you honestly think treating the average American like an idiot is the way to reach them? She was not likeable. She was annoying and pandering. She didn’t answer anything. She didn’t even understand the nuclear question and completely failed to answer the bancruptcy question. She didn’t give any plan on an Iraq exit strategy, she didn’t know specifics about Afghanistan.
It’s easy to hear what you want to hear. Palin didn’t screw up but she did very little to restore voter confidence. She was not going to reach independents with that performance last night. It was another move to shore up her base.
zyskandar: Your “Champ” analogy hit the proverbial nail on its head. Your humor and satire, when employed, works a lot better than your vitriol. Only my opinion. Sure enjoyed that “Champ” stuff. Old Senator Joe tried to make it sound like his father was the first to use the tired cliche. “when you get knocked down, get back up,” routine. Talk about plagiarism!
SR…I’m getting the feeling that like your guy Ralph Nader you are “Unsafe At Any Speed.” Just kidding. Maybe.
I agree Nader was right in predicting the big financial problems, and that he did it years ago. That’s about the second time he was right since he wrote about the Chevy Corvairs way back in the ‘60s.
Your shots at Palin are expected, since you are for Nader. Palin did just fine. And BTW, the overnight ratings reveal this was the highest-watched debate of any kind since ‘92. I think we’d all agree those viewers weren’t tuning in to see Biden tell tall tales.
Ed…Don’t you think someone should explain to Zyskander what paragraphs are? And how they make reading comments, even his, so much easier?
to ed1 – Thank you ed1. My vitriol – as you put it – is directed at stoopidity. Have never suffered ‘fools’ well or at anytime. Glad you enjoyed/were interested at my attempts at humour/satire/sardonic comments. Perhaps after ‘Hairplug’JOE becomes VEEP – he could go on a road-tour axsking(ebonics spelling) ‘everybody to stand-up out of their wheelchairs and be patriotic by paying more taxes’. Ba-dumpdump.
Jiminy – now I know that you are not Zyskandar! I thought he might be your Mr. Hyde after having downed a large pitcher of abysinth mixed with 180 proof rum. Gotta love his Jackie Coogan/Wallace Beery reference. By the way, Cooper supposedly said that Beery was in real life the scariest, meanest man he ever met.
BTW, I have season tickets for the Ebonics at MSG. Gonna miss Marbury like Tom Landry missed Hollywood Henderson.
Ed….You could even mean an absinthe afternoon in New Orleans. The Absinthe House is a locally well-known old bar in the French Quarter.
Tom Landry, if he wasn’t such a fine and non-drinking person, might have considered flying from Dallas to New Orleans and the Absinthe House after having to deal with Hollywood Henderson.
I also suspect Wallace Beery might have been one of the Consulant’s notorious uncles.
Unlikely the Consultant would admit to a relative named Beery. Maybe Uncle Malty. Or Duc de Champagne.
ah yes…Dominick Perignone..and to SR sarah did not
treat the average american like an idiot..she connects
with the average american..that was the whole point
of putting her on the ticket…you know..joe six pack
hockey moms..yesseree bob…say it isn’t so joe..
SR needs to understand that the McCain campaign thought
it needed to get the middle class white working voters
who populate the heartlands..so even though she does
not appeal to you as an easterner…that is not what
they were going for…However wait until wednesday
and watch the tracking polls in the battleground
states..if it doesn’t get better for McCain than
Palin as a VP choice will be irrelevant ..the economy
will determine the outcome in the election and will
overcome any bradley effect if there is one this year
1. normally african american candidates like wilder
and bradley do about 3% points worse in the actual
voting then in the polling
2. this year may be different because the Obama team
has registered lots of new young voters many of whom
do not have hard line telephones but rather cell phones
which are not part of the polling techniques
3. when the economy tanks as badly as this one, older
voters 50 plus look at their 401K’s and say to themselves
they want change ..any change regardless of implication
4. Hedge fund managers are pushing the markets down
redemption letters have to be in shortly and they have
to liquidate at huge losses which exacerbates the market
sell offs (thats why the market still went down today
regardless of the bailout)
5. the bailout will not have any effect until credit
markets unfreeze…and that could take months
SO MCCAIN NEEDS TO CHANGE THE DYNAMIC EITHER IN THE
UPCOMING DEBATE OR IN SOME OTHER WAY…I COULD
MAKE A SUGGESTION BUT JIMINY WOULD GET UPSET
Interesting point #2. Never thought of that. Seems like no one under 30 owns a landline phone, or has even the slightest interest in them.
SR wrote, “Jiminy, Colin Powell, Don Rumsfeld, George H.W. Bush, and many others were against the first Gulf War only until Saudi Arabia, Jordan, and Israel put pressure on us to fight it. Biden’s position on that war is not a viable attack from Republicans because it was a majority position.”
That is absurd. The current war was supported by the majority of Americans. By your logic, should Bush be immune from criticism because the majority of Americans supported the war in 2003? There was a vote on the first Persian Gulf War and Biden voted against it. Obviously, the majority of Senators voted in favor of the first Gulf War or we wouldn’t have been there. George HW Bush favored it and pushed for the Senate and UN votes otherwise we wouldn’t have gone to Kuwait.
Biden was wrong in 1991 and that is a legitimate criticism of his foreign policy judgment. To say otherwise is just foolish.
As for last night’s debate, I unfortunately concluded that it was a draw (Biden on substance, Palin on style) and for Obama that is as good as a win as he is ahead in the polls and has the momentum. While it was nice to see Palin do a little bit better than her recent interviews, she needed to do more to win the debate. Using notecards, mispronouncing general’s names, and failing to respond to Biden’s arguments were all signs that she wasn’t as prepared as she could have been.
Ian,
When Saddam invaded Kuwait, G.H.W. bush, Powell, Rumsfeld, and Cheney were inclined to do nothing. In fact it was confirmed in an interview with Powell and bush Sr. in 94’ that the original sentiment was that a Saddam controlled Kuwait was more beneficial to the U.S. and our Oil interests because Saddam was an ally.
That sentiment only changed after Saudi Arabia and Israel put pressure on the administration to act as well as the U.N.
Saddam and Rumsfeld were very close and most in the U.S. saw him as a close ally. Why would Powell have admitted this?
Not to mention while that war did liberate Kuwait (against administration original desires)it never won against Saddam or win in Iraq. Bush Sr. again openly admitted in 1994 that he was scared to depose Saddam because of an inevitable Civil War would break out in the unstable country and Iran would spring to the forefront.
Biden was not wrong. We did not win the first Gulf War and we have yet to win this one. The Surge only delayed the inevitable. We can stay in Iraq for another 10 years and it won’t make any difference. It is Viet Nam all over again. The minute we walk away from Iraq it will fall apart. The Iraqi government right now wants us out of there. They are begging Bush to get us out and they want to run things their way. We are the ones refusing to leave. But mark my words, once we do leave that country will slip back into a Civil War and wil no longer function for us.
You can check the Washington Post’s opinion blog for a partial listing of “Say It Ain’t So, Joe!” Biden’s foreign policy misstatements in the debate. He made a lot of other factual errors too. Not very good for such an “expert.” Biden is today what he always has been, an inside the Beltway b.s. artist and windbag.
Ed…cell phones and polls don’t mean a thing if they don’t show up to vote. Odds are many won’t. I also think this Ohio deal could end up in a high Federal court. There are a slew of ACORN types in that state taking people to the polls, including the homeless, registering them and having them vote on the spot—now. Guess who they are all voting for?
Consultant, yes I would be upset at your suggestion. You would NOT be a good substitute for Palin. But I do think you could take Biden’s place. :)
SR, the majority of people (since you seem to believe that is proper criteria) believe we won the First Gulf War. If we hadn’t, Saddam Hussein would still be in Kuwait. We more than achieved our objective of getting Saddam Hussein out of Kuwait (regardless if that was our initial objective or not).
“Saddam and Rumsfeld were very close and most in the U.S. saw him as a close ally. Why would Powell have admitted this?”
Not true. I am not sure what Powell said or did not say but Rumsfeld was not a close ally of Saddam Hussein’s but a practitioner of real politik during the Iran-Iraq War. Moreover, Rumsfeld was irrelevant in 1990. He did not serve in any official capacity in HW Bush’s government.
We were never in favor of Iraq staying in Kuwait and I defy you to provide any objective source that said we were. Please note that objective source is not synonymous with Lyndon LaRouche. Bush, had doubts about military action but he took it. Powell, was the only one in the administration who wasn’t that supportive at the time of military action. Biden, voted against the first Gulf War. Almost every person in America concedes that the military action was a sucess, we liberated Kuwait, and that HW Bush was right. I bet Biden would even concede that.
You have a fringe position that is immune to logic.
Actually, the biggest error Biden made was not knowing what Article I of the Constitution says. For a guy who spent 30 years in the Senate and was the head of the judiciary committee that is pretty scary. That said, he sounded like he knew what he was talking about and that is what usually counts.
Very logical and correct, Ian. Bush Sr. said “This will not stand!” Powell wanted overwhelming force and he got it. If the first Gulf war wasn’t a success, no war in history was. SR comes to strange conclusions and then backtracks to try to find “facts” that make his conclusions seem plausible. When you see this kind of logic being machinated, you can safely disregard the argument as facile and faulty. Educated Democrats often do the same thing, but are usually more clever in the presentation.
the first gulf war was supported by all of bush 41’s
cabinet particularly general powell.the notion that
the US needed saudi arabia and Israel to insist on
stopping SADAM from taking Kuwait is sheer nonsense
It was naked aggression on a major oil producing nation
the reason they did not go to Bagdad is that some felt
that a dictator in place would be better than
a sunni shiate confrontation….and it appears they
were correct
SR sounds like Biden, who in the debate said he and Obama supported NATO intervention when the US and France kicked Hezbollah out of Lebanon.
None of that happened. The statement was totally false. Say It Ain’t So Joe! did it again.
Biden also made at least one dozen other false statements in the debate. But most of the press would rather dissect Palin. “Mister Experience” and SR could hit the road together as the new Abbott and Costello. Since SR is a Nader supporter, or so he says, they could even drive an old Corvair from town to town.
But don’t go to that Delaware restaurant or coffee shop “Hometown” Biden also talked about. It closed 15 years ago.
Powell did state the position that they had no intention of doing anything about Saddam in Kuwait. It was in a CNN interview from 1994 in which he and Bush Sr. were interviewed about the war. I used to have links to clips but they are dead. Sorry.
Everything I said about why they were considering doing nothing is from what he said. There was advanced warning to Saddam’s invasion. Powell stated that there were forces inside Washington who felt that Saddam would have been a better ally in Kuwait but international pressure changed that thought.
And as to Biden. Most of the Democrats voted no against that war as they wanted more Diplomacy.
“Yes, I voted against the war. This was partly because I thought that diplomacy had not been exhausted, as it should be before the lives of American troops are put at risk. Also, it was partly because I was against giving a blank check to the first President Bush and his Secretary of Defense Dick Cheney to blow past Kuwait and invade Iraq. Thank God President Bush’s father, unlike his son, had enough sense to not proceed to Baghdad.”
I just aquired my first absinthe spoons and for some time I have been checking absinth varieties and have noticed that 1901 is a popular type in UK. Is this the case elseware. Here in Australia, I find a lot of types I have not noticed before and can’t locate reviews for. It would be helpful if some of you folks who are familiar with absinthe would provide their top shelf types. I am new to the fee verte and was recommended that Lucid is a good blanche to start with. Opinions on is also needed. So I bought a bottle of Mansinthe to give it a try and am extremely happy with my decision to buy it.